Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

Post by deckofficer »

Is anyone using electric propulsion on their PDQs? I would think the Torqeedo 4.0 with the thrust equal to a 9.9 hp, would work rather well. Considering an electric motor has all available torque at 1 rpm, and unlike a gas outboard, has a usable operating range starting at 1 rpm, should make precision docking child's play.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

Post by thinwater »

I think you'll find this thread...
http://www.multihulls4us.com/forums/sho ... t=torquedo
... has covered the subject in depth.

Less power, far less range, more cost, more quiet. As for control, that's probably a matter of practice; my first days were rather ugly to watch, but now I back with very little shifting and great accuracy. Electrics wouldn't help unless they had MORE power in reverse for those high cross-wind and cross-current days; even then planning trumps power every time.

Most of us think it is a poor compromise, but most think it is interesting!
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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I'm still hoping someone is using EP on their PDQ 36 and can tell me how they like it. I have built one electric vehicle, converted one from gas to electric, and bought an Electric Smart Car. In marine propulsion, nothing is more precise or can swing a tall pitched screw like an electric motor and it's full torque a 1 rpm. Instant and smooth transition from forward to astern propulsion. I will be converting my next boat to EP. The last rig I served on has (6) 5,000 hp electric azipods and I had no problem maintaining position over a well head a mile down in any weather. Could never do that with a diesel direct couple to prop shaft.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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II the Max was built with a single Yanmar diesel in the port hull which is perfect once under way - plenty of power and economical. On a calm day with a clean bottom we can do 6 kts burning about 1/2 gal per hour. But, maneuvering was another thing - the previous owner kept (Buckaroo then) on a mooring and shuttled fuel out by dinghy. When we bought her shortly after the maiden voyage from the upper bay to DC (luckily there were no mishaps at during the few stops we made) I mounted a 12v trolling motor on the Stbd hull. It worked OK if there was minimal wind and tide, but no where near enough thrust. When Torquedo came out with the 24v 2.0 I upgraded, see pictures (the 1st one shows the original trolling motor still installed - I used an antenna mount bracket so it could flip up out of the water). It required adding a 24v charging circuit and a pair of group 24 batts. The charging circuit is AC only, but for the 10 minutes per trip we use the Torquedo it's perfect (we charge the batts about every other trip). Last year we sheared a shaft key bolt (fell out actually) on the diesel and it was great having the Torquedo for backup as it will move the boat in open water.

For primary power I think that the Torquedo construction is a little delicate, the 4.0 is also 36v and pretty expensive. Our 2.0 is mounted off the port side of cockpit stern and I think it would work better mounted closer to the rudder (at least further aft than it is now). All in all it's a great product but I don't think it is up to the task of all day motoring as primary propulsion. Also the props are plastic and a good hit would take them right out and possibly damage the unit.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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Thanks Mike, just what I was looking for, an unbiased, owner's comment. Even though your assessment wasn't what I wanted to hear, you have the experience, I don't. There are some other choices, two more expensive, one less expensive. I just want reliability should I need to motor, running the DC gen-set, for days on end.

This one is overkill at 13 Kw but is within 3/8" in size of the power head on a Yamaha 9.9. A pair would probably push a PDQ 36 at 10+ kt. And is a bit more than twice the cost of the 4.0 Torqeedo.
http://www.aquawatt.at/en/electric-outboards.php

This one, as above, is more expensive than the Torqeedo, with about 40 more static pounds of thrust than the 4.0 48 volt Torqeedo
http://www.rayeo.com/motors/

This one is cheaper than the Torqeedo, at least for the 4 & 5 hp offering. Haven't found a price on the 10 hp. Not as efficient or as light as the Torqeedo, but none of the other choices are, so what is a guy to do? Bite the bullet and go with the Rayeo or the 10 hp Parsuns? I just hate to go with much less efficiency and much more weight, it just rubs the wrong way.
http://www.parsunmarine.com/products_xin_3.asp
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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It actually works great for what we use it for, but for any distance that Yanmar is hard to beat. We have our battery bank in aft part of the Stbd. cockpit locker and a holding tank behind the head to offset the weight of the diesel.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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maxicrom wrote:It actually works great for what we use it for, but for any distance that Yanmar is hard to beat. We have our battery bank in aft part of the Stbd. cockpit locker and a holding tank behind the head to offset the weight of the diesel.
Mike,

My question to you then, if you had a pair of the Torqeedo 4.0 48 volt outboards, and had a diesel DC gen-set that could keep up with their power consumption, do you feel they are built well enough to run at 3/4 power for days at a time if needed?
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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On the PDQ 32...
9.9 hp = 5.8 knots
19.8 hp = 7.2 knots

10 knots is going to take more hp than you may think. Based upon performance under sail, perhaps 60 hp. Anything over 7.6 knots on the PDQ 36 is probably pretty silly.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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thinwater wrote:On the PDQ 32...
9.9 hp = 5.8 knots
19.8 hp = 7.2 knots

10 knots is going to take more hp than you may think. Based upon performance under sail, perhaps 60 hp. Anything over 7.6 knots on the PDQ 36 is probably pretty silly.
Your probably right, that is why I said a pair of 13Kw electric outboards would be overkill @ 35 hp, even though they would fit.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

Post by maxicrom »

Just saw your post,

You would have to see what the manufacturer suggests and the warranty (duty cycle, salt water, open ocean use, etc...). I think they designed the 4.0's for commercial use, water taxi's and such, the 48 volt power supply stopped me. But you make a good point 2 of those with a Panda sized gen set might be a good economical and low weight option.

For ours the ideal would be build a hinged mount that would allow the motor to flip up and down to a fixed position. When I did this one I was pressed for time and tried to use parts of the existing mount. The result works OK but I'm not happy with the installation (if we ever get a winter when we can store the boat on land it will get re-done).

Keep us posted on your progress,

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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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... And with the generators it's now more complicated, more expensive, bulkier, heavier, and would have worse mileage than running outboards, with no measurable advantages, unless...

... You have a large electric load at anchor. Cruise ships are often hybrid because they use nearly as much power at the dock running AC and the casino as they do underway. But few sailors can imagine that much generator time.

Yes, it can be done and it would work, but I really think this is a solution hunting for a problem.

Yes, I know they would shift smoother, but unless there is more thrust in reverse than the Yamaha 9.9, it won't help. I back into my slip every time, and I don't shift much. As I go down the lane to my slip I shift the outboard engine into reverse about 1/3, leaving the inboard in forward at idle. The boat starts to slow and skid around sideways, reaching 90 degrees just as it passes the slip, at which time, if I got it right, she's beginning to back. The rest is fine tuning the throttle, but no shifting until it's time to stop.
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Re: Torqeedo 4.0 electric outboards

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Page 83 has a Westerbeke 5KW generator in what used to be a berth port hull aft. It weighs 700 pounds with the fuel tank, sound enclosure et al. It does not produce enough power to drive two torqedo 4.0 cruises. It cost $15000 installed eight years ago. There are newer and better gennies around, but the best quote I've seen for an 8kw DC generator is in the neighborhood of $20,000. Lets see, how many High Thrust Yamaha 9.9's will that buy? How much weight does it add wih ultra efficient Lithium Iron batts? The devil is in the details!
Sandy Daugherty "Page 83" PDQ 36026
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